Mastery Points

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  • Zeke Kaiser
    @zekekaiser

    I am positive that I have seen it provide me with 0 silver upgrades once. I remember this because the one before it had given me one, and I was very displeased. I don’t have any proof though.

    MVNLA2
    @mvnla2

    @zekekaiser — Thanks for the info! Perhaps if we looked through the previous 18 pages of posts we’d find a few more 0 snoutling offers. My record doesn’t go back that far.

    KerrAvon
    @kerravon

    @mvnla2 If we reduce it to just 2 chests, a LC chest and a snoutling chest, as @larry suggests then,

    If a slot on the dojo becomes available and a chest is selected, then the second selection (for the specific bird or class) would only be made from items in the chest that are not already on the board.

    Or, if the selection made on the dojo is identical to something already present in another slot, then the selection process is repeated.

    Oh, and I am pretty sure I have had zero offerings once. And I think killerkea has mentioned that he has had zero offerings.

    @kerravon, @mvnla2, if the dojo does offer 0 lucky coins, the odds are obviously very low. Since none of us recorded anything like this in our sheets, it could be just a 1% chance or something. Perhaps the dojo is not set up with a guaranteed first snoutling offer, but a 99% chance or something. In that case I could have come across it during the LC re-rolls. Since I did that pretty fast, i might have just skipped past this thinking that pressing the re-roll just didn’t respond while instead I just got 0 snoutling offerings.

    @kerravon, @mvnla2

    Oh, wait, I’ve got it!

    If the snoutling offering has a 67% chance (2/3) to come up in any slot, you would get a 3,7% chance that the dojo contains no snoutling offerings at all.

    Each slot gives a 2/3 chance to come up with a snoutling offering.
    To get one slot WITHOUT a snoutling offering is 1/3.
    2 slots without a snoutling offering gives you 1/3*1/3=0,11=11% chance.
    3 slots without a snoutling offering gives you 1/3*1/3*1/3=0,037=3,7% chance.

    In that case the math works out for 100%, including the zero offerings you have seen.
    On average you will get 3*(2/3) snoutling offerings on the initial visit, which adds up to 2. After that the rest applies normally as described in my earlier post and everything should average at 6 snoutling offerings.

    I believe this nut is cracked.

    For anyone interested in keeping track of the birds mastery levels, I’ve created an Excel spreadsheet for this. It’s based on my own tracking when I was farming for LC’s and Snoutlings to determine what I would need to get all my birds upgraded.

    I’ve made it as easy as possible. Just collect all info on the ranks for your birds and fill out the current dojo discount and the average amount of visits you make per day.

    This table assumes only dojo upgrades.

    You can find it here (public dropbox link) or at the following address: https://www.dropbox.com/s/3b5jy4fypgu95e6/Mastery%20table.xlsx?dl=0

    @mvnla2, if you think it is useful, feel free to use the link on the first page.

    KerrAvon
    @kerravon

    @larry You did mention that mathematics was not a strong point. Please don’t take offense. I believe this sums it up.

    Some assumptions first
    the chance of a snoutling offer is 2/3
    the chance of a LC offer is 1/3

    At the dojo there are 4 possible outcomes
    3 LC offers: probability = 1/3 x 1/3 x 1/3 = 1/27
    3 snoutling offers: probability = 2/3 x 2/3 x 2/3 = 8/27

    1 snoutling offers
    There are 3 ways this can occur (S=snoutling offer, LC = lucky coin offer)
    (1) slot 1 = S, slot 2 = LC, slot 3 = LC
    (2) slot 1 = LC, slot 2 = S, slot 3 = LC
    (3) slot 1 = LC, slot 2 = LC, slot 3 = S
    probability for each = 2/3 x 1/3 x 1/3 = 2/27
    multiply this by 3 = 6/27

    2 snoutling offers
    There are 3 ways this can occur
    (1) slot 1 = S, slot 2 = S, slot 3 = LC
    (2) slot 1 = S, slot 2 = LC, slot 3 = S
    (3) slot 1 = LC, slot 2 = S, slot 3 = S
    probability for each = 2/3 x 2/3 x 1/3 = 4/27
    multiply this by 3 = 12/27

    Adding these 1/27 + 8/27 + 6/27 + 12/27 = 27/27 = 1

    The most common outcome is 2 snoutling offers (12/27), then 3 snoutling offers (8/27), then 1 snoutling offer (6/27) and least 0 snoutling offers (1/27 = 0.037)

    This is just for the initial offerings at the dojo and is based on 2/3 chance of getting a snoutling offering in each slot. We don’t know what the actual chance is, or whether there are just 2 options (LC or snoutling).

    Sutekh137
    @sutekh137

    @KerrAvon

    You and your Bard. *smile* OK, I will finally save up LC and buy that dang class, especially if I can just immediately master it!


    @larry

    Y’all are beyond me. I like maths, but suck at statistics/combinations/permutations. But it sounds like you are on the right track!

    I don’t recall very many times of having a zero-snoutling offering, but I suppose 3.7% could be about right…

    You guys are analysis demons!

    Thanks,
    sutekh137

    @kerravon, Thanks for providing me with the correct math! I came to the correct results with the 0 and 3, but was struggling with the 1 and 2 odds. Your explanation is excellent and this is exactly what I was looking for.

    Everything else after accepting the average amount of offerings is just a matter of an infinite Excel calculation (every offer has a 66% chance to re-occur to infinity) and it ends up at a nice 6.

    Even if the 75LC and 15LC offers are divided over multiple chests, it really doesn’t matter that much. The numbers are really straight forward and probably fit into a 1/9 75LC, 2/9 15LC and 6/9 Snouts comparison or something simple like that.

    You’ve just confirmed that we cracked the math behind the dojo.


    @mvnla2
    , this would be our conclusion I guess. I don’t think there’s much more to work out here.


    @sutekh137
    , thanks. It’s a fun one to crack, but it helps that we had the data to reverse engineer this thing.

    @sutekh137, you may want to do some LC farming. I just posted the method in the main epic forum.

    KillerKea
    @killerkea

    A few months ago I speculated that based on the patterns we saw the dojo using that once you get all but one bird to rank 10 the game would give you unlimited snoutling upgrades for your last bird until it also reached rank 10. At least one player confirmed that within a month and I was able to confirm that about a month ago myself.

    Therefore you can potentially buy 1500 or more consecutive snoutling upgrades in one visit if you plan things right. It takes 274 snoutling upgrades to get a rank 1 bird to rank 10. Let’s say it costs 73 snoutlings/upgrade since 274 * 73 = 20,002 which we can round off to 20K.

    All you do is don’t buy headsets until you get your main headsets to rank 10. Once you have your main headsets all at rank 10 you can buy the remaining headsets ONE at a time and take each to the dojo to upgrade it from rank 1 to rank 10 spending 20K of snoutlings each time. Let’s say you are able to play with only 15 headsets and get 14 to rank 10. If you have a little over 200K of snoutlings and enough LC to buy the remaining headsets you can immediately get the remaining 11 headsets to rank 10. That would be 2740+ snoutling purchases you can make consecutively. It might take you more than 3 hours to buy everything, but you get the point.

    Sutekh137
    @sutekh137

    @KillerKea, @larry

    Just got enough LC (using Immortal Larry’s time zone exploit) to buy Bard (finally, @KerrAvon! *smile*), and leveled her up all the way to mastery 10. Only took about 5-10 minutes on my tablet, the buy option comes up so that you can tap it about once every second…

    So, this is definitely the way to do it, one at a time. I had 21 headgears before I started trying for mastery in earnest, so I used auto-grinding on CPC for that (as well as buying advances at the Dojo when I could). This way, one at a time, is much easier. *smile* I’ve plenty of snoutlings for the remaining three classes should I go for those. I’ll probably try for Skulkers since it only costs 150 LC, but I am not sure about Sea Dog and Thunderbird. Even with the time zone bug, it will take a while to reach 275 LC (x2). Actually, I guess it would only be 4-5 days (per headgear) if I can get 15-20 Golden Pig fights in per day…

    Then what will I do? *smile*

    Thanks,
    sutekh137

    @sutekh137, go for seadog! He’s massive damage and does it twice per round. 3 times if you’re doing it smart. When he’s leveled up, he’ll do around 1400 damage per hit (as long as he’s not damaged since his damage goed down with his health).

    MysticBurn
    @renitz

    @sutekh137 Wait you bought Bard and ten minutes later your on mastery lvl 10, how?

    @renitz, You should read up in the earlier posts. If you have enough snoutlings and all other birds at rank 10, you can instantly upgrade any new classes you buy.

    Snoutlings can be easily farmed (with effort).

    MysticBurn
    @renitz

    @sutekh137 @larry While I was typing figured that sutekh probably has rest of his birds lvl 10, but expected a time limit factor in dojo. but indeed if he also uses LC to buy mastery en then there is no time limit.

    Sutekh137
    @sutekh137

    @renitz

    No LC at the Dojo, just snoutlings, as the new headgear was the only one not at level 10 (so you can keep advancing it all the way to 10 in one sitting…)

    As @larry already said, it is relatively straightforward. I had over 140,000 snoutlings from auto-farming Star Reef Castle. So, I had well over the 20,000 or so needed to just keep tapping mastery at the Dojo. The duration it takes is simply the length of time it takes to tap 274 times. *smile*

    For the past couple of months I have basically just done:

    Cobalt Pig Castle: For experience and mastery, got all my classes to Level 10 mastery this way (plus Dojo upgrades when possible). Ended up with around 50,000 snoutlings, too, after 5-6 weeks of that.

    Star Reef Castle: Money, money, money. Got ~100,000 more snoutlings over a couple weeks. Just auto-play with Wizard, Bomb, and Spies (or any number of combinations) and you can get through it many times an hour (again, just auto-play it).

    Golden Pig/time zone exploit: For LC. Not sure if I will keep doing the exploit to get Skulkers, Sea Dog, and Thunderbird, but I don’t have anything else to do. *smile*

    Events: do it for stamina drinks in case they raise mastery level later (though one can just as easily use CPC for that and grind it out…it is faster than Event rewards.)

    Arena: I have never gotten into it, and don’t plan to start.

    Thanks,
    sutekh137

    MysticBurn
    @renitz

    @sutekh137 Thanks for your answer, since I know that the end price of arena is just a trophy and frame around avatar, i’m focusing more on mastery then arena

    MVNLA2
    @mvnla2

    @Dr_Ishmael, @all — Update on LC offerings at Dojo:
    I’ve now made 116 trips to the Dojo, buying all snoutling offerings each time.
    When I first reported on LC offerings, the blues had the highest %; now they have the lowest. The total number of offerings for each individual bird is still somewhat on the low side ~50 each. However, I’m am willing to bet at least one LC that the final numbers will be the following:
    All: 30%
    Each individual bird: 14%
    [Edit:
    Well, it’s a good thing I only bet 1 LC. There is at least one other possibility, but I like my previous guess better.]
    There are 7 possible choices
    My current numbers:

    All	102	29.3%
    Red	48	13.8%
    Chuck	51	14.7%
    Blues	43	12.4%
    Bomb	51	14.7%
    Matilda	53	15.2%
    MVNLA2
    @mvnla2

    @Larry @KerrAvon — Congrats on the great analysis. Just had time to read through it, and it sounds good.

    cy.
    @chuyuet

    Hey, What does double mastery drop for king pig mean? The whole battle’s mastery point is doubled or the double only applies to the killing of king pig? If it is on the whole battle’s mastery’s point, it means that normally you get 40 mastery points but after you kill king pig, you can get 80 points from one such battle. Am I right?

    Sutekh137
    @sutekh137

    @chuyuet

    I read it as him just dropping two medals, essentially. He doesn’t drop a “doubler”, he, personally, just drops double the goods.

    Much more knowledgeable folks can correct me if I’m wrong…

    Thanks,
    sutekh137

    dr_ishmael
    @dr_ishmael

    @chuyuet @suteck137 King Pig (and all the other “boss”-type pigs) doesn’t really drop two ribbons, the ribbon he does drop is worth twice as many mastery points.

    MVNLA2
    @mvnla2

    @Dr_Ishmael It’s probably time to do another update on probability of LC offerings at the Dojo. A major reason being that this is it for me until they raise the top rank. I now have all classes at rank 10. It happened a little sooner than I expected. On my last trip to the Dojo, I had 3 classes (for 3 different birds) still at rank 9. Marksmen was the closest, and they got to rank 10 with 2 offerings. However, after 1 offering, I got a board with offerings for cleric and berserker, and one blank. After the next choice the board went back to 3 offerings, and marksmen went to rank 10. After that I continued to get offerings for berserker and cleric until they both reached rank 10.
    I am now down to ~45K snoutlings and back to farming at SRC.
    So here’s my final set of data. If you post your final or current data I will combine them and put in main post.

    All	142	28.9%
    Red	72	14.6%
    Chuck	68	13.8%
    Blues	63	12.8%
    Bomb	71	14.4%
    Matilda	76	15.4%
    	492	100%

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