Cheaters

[Immortal… Larry]

@strategia55, Wow! Romoved… That sounds interesting!

[burbman]

@larry – I have not seen any obvious objective resetters in my league this week. Did the new update solve that issue, or am I just lucky so far? Figured you might have checked.

[t_russell]

@burbman — Out of morbid curiosity I checked the objective reset this morning to see if anything had been done. I installed the update yesterday. Alas I still had no trouble performing this simple feat. Hopefully your board stays clean, mine shows four obvious cheaters leaving me in fifth place. This is the first and only time I plan on doing this. I did play the daily pig so as not to reset a week, but I won’t be taking any extra points in the arena. One days reset wouldn’t get me into the top three anyway.

[ToothGnasher]

@jorge-freeman-1

@killerKea ~ If I remember this subject well the signal (+ or -) of a number on some systems is given by the leftmost bit. If that bit is a 0 the number is positive and it is negative if the bit is 1. FFFF is hexadecimal for a binary number with 32 bits, all 1s. It is the highest binary number that you can represent with 32 bits but as the leftmost bit is 1 it is a negative number of 31 bits where negative numbers are taken into consideration.

As a programmer, myself, let me elaborate. The program allows 32 bit numbers and treats all the bits as significant AND as positive numbers. It’s only the routine that writes the output on the scoreboard that is rendering the number as negative.

For example “111” in binary would be 7, but if the first bit is treated as a sign, it would be -3 (because 11 in binary = 3 in decimal).

Here is a reference that may explain it better: http://www.allaboutcircuits.com/vol_4/chpt_2/3.html

[Immortal… Larry]

@burbman, I’m delaying the update as long as the game keeps working without it. Since the massive bugs with the last updates, I’ve disabled automatic updates for this one. I will wait at least a week before installing any updates (which I can choose to delay) so I can be somewhat sure about what to expect.

Besides, I’d like the flow of LC’s to continue a bit longer… :)

[minigurlnikki]

@larry Something changed with the Lucky Coins if you update to 1.2.3?

[senigami]

@larry, @jsant, @bubbley, @tigerussell, @mvnla2 – and all those who are fed up with cheaters. I have discovered a way to have a lineup nearly guaranteed to be devoid of cheaters. This is not an exploit, a bug, or cheating, but an understanding of how lineups are created. I have tested this on 3 different games and different levels and can confirm working every time.

The secret lies in understanding not only the method Rovio uses for creating lineups but also the thinking of the cheaters themselves.

When you complete a weekly round and check to see if you succeeded in advancing, you signal the server to enter you into a new league. The trick here is to be patient. Cheaters will not want to waste any time entering a new league and beefing up their score. Therefore the first leagues to form will contain the most cheaters.

I tested this with my daughters game where we have previously seen no cheaters. I checked the score seconds after the time ended and within 10 min nearly everyone had reached 5k points, and very shortly up to 11k. All this without ever starting a game, (score of zero)

I did not load my level 41 game (gold league) for a number of hours and currently do not have a single cheater. Same with my level 5 game. I have been having fun playing and now it really doesn’t matter when Rovio gets to fix this bug because I stand back and let all the cheaters ahead of me in line.

Also I have discovered how to limit the number of people in an arena and have a lineup containing a total of 1 players. Me. I don’t know if the admins would consider that cheating so I won’t post how I did that yet. Perhaps I may post it and let admins edit as necessary. Personally I don’t feel that I am actually cheating, but simply understanding how the systems works.

[senigami]

Another interesting fact, posted earlier by @kerravon in Golden Pig Machine, is how to get legendary items from friends free rolls. The free roll on a friends pig uses the same percentage for obtaining a set item as your rainbow bar. Once you understand that logic then the rest just makes sense.

If you have your rainbow bar filled up, (so the next roll is guaranteed set item) and you also have the notice on the side to watch a video for a free roll then your free friend roll will always give you a set item without costing you anything. Not sure why the video link needs to be there but for some reason it does. Do not watch the video or make a roll on your rainbow.

You should be able to receive a set item every couple of days on the free roll, this also works for the arena golden pig. I don’t believe this is fast enough to constitute cheating, nor do I believe this is this a bug or exploit. It takes a very long time to obtain all the set items this way and since you need to keep getting new ones as you level up, even the set items you receive will not be as powerful as some of the items you obtain as you move through the game advancing. This only has the advantage that it won’t cost you any more than the initial cost of filling your rainbow bar 1 time.

I’m not sure how the new update will effect this method so I thought I’d throw it out now while you still have a chance to use it.

Edit: This has been patched in the latest update so I guess it really was a bug. Bummer.

[senigami]

Okay, here is the info I withheld from my previous post.

I debated posting this information from the desire to create fair leagues and keep the cheaters out. Please do not use this or the previously mentioned method if you plan on cheating. As @larry mentioned earlier (and I can vouch for from personal experience), you would have more fun playing against other cheaters in an exciting high paced action filled run for super high scores than in a game where it was too easy. That being said, I can’t control what you do but I hope you make a decision that allows others who wish to continue to enjoy the game to do so.

I originally stumbled on the concept mentioned earlier when I began a new game. I wasn’t far enough into the game to join the arena until late Thursday. I thought for sure I would be really behind since others would have had days to beef up their scores. However Rovio is really good about trying to keep the game fair by not joining you to a game where you would have the handicapped disadvantage. Soon I began to see others join my league, none of which had scores that indicated they had played earlier in the week.

It would appear that, by design, you can only join a league where you and the other players have an equal and fair chance at arriving at the same score. (assuming no other cheating methods of course) I decided to test this logic on my level 41 game, in the gold league, to see if the same rules applied to the higher levels. I waited longer than 24 hours before checking my scores so that I would loose an entire day’s worth of playing in the arena. I figured at worst I could reset my scores 1 time to catch up, but as it turns out my league creation theory was correct. However in this case not a single other gold league player was willing to loose an entire day’s worth of scores. Therefore Rovio had no choice but to fairly place me into a league containing all players with a 1 day handicap. Also now that 2 days have passed no other players can join my league as that would be unfair to them.

Thus I have a league all to myself while adhering to the proper rules of fair game play. I’ll admit that while not as entertaining as playing with others, I have discovered a method to guarantee my way to the diamond league without fighting against cheaters, (or any competition for that matter). Naturally now that I have posted the method here I expect that I may have some company next week. Looking forward to seeing any of you in my leagues. Or perhaps I’ll wait 2 days before starting a league next time. ;-) Perhaps we can have 3 people in our league and compete while still all advancing.

My apologies if the admins feel this is cheating, I don’t agree. I’m just tired of having to deal with the cheaters and this method gets me away from them. I felt I had a responsibility to share.

[Immortal… Larry]

@steven-dunn-5648, This is brilliant information and I am absolutely certain that it will help many people who have been stuck in the lower leagues due to cheaters.

Is there anyone who can back this up? Just want to make sure it’s not just coincidence or a one-time glitch…

I agree about this not having anything to do with cheating. The reasoning is sound and fits with the way Rovio intends to make the game work for everyone. We have seen this in the events as well where everyone has a shot at winning, regardless of their levels by making sure everyone has his or her own competition. Obviously the arena has leagues which are actually the same for everyone in them. Making sure that late joiners don’t compete against first day players only makes sense.

If someone can back this up, I’ll include it in the first post.

Thanks Senigami, I think this is much appreciated and I may join your league next week. I like the thrill of competing against cheaters, but I just don’t have the time to reach 20 sets of objectives each day (top of my league is already over 100K and I’m at 60 now), so I would really prefer doing it by the book…

[burbman]

@larry, I have observed the latecomer advantage on my son’s game. He doesn’t play all that often, and usually ends up in a fair league even if he starts on a Wednesday. Never thought about using it myself though.

[Immortal… Larry]

@burbman Ok, just added a reference in the first post. Let’s see if more people can confirm. This could be a way out for many who are fed up with the arena…

Let your son know he may be up for some competition next week… :)

[Immortal… Larry]

@steven-dunn-5648, @burbman, I think another element comes into this as well. Since you’re familiar with the reset exploit (as a reference), it may seem likely that a league is formed per “hour” instead of per day. I base this on the fact that you are alone in your league. Considering the amount of players in the entire world, getting a league of your own based on nobody in the world joining in a day would not make sense… An hour is a different story and fits many other aspects of the game.

If this is true, we could run a little experiment next week where a group of people from the nest check into the arena at the exact same date/time. This way we could form our very own birdsnest league. Anyone up for this experiment?

Wow, this could be fun!

[senigami]

@larry, It’s also hard to imagine that anyone with the dedication to fight their way up to the gold league level 41 would simply walk away from an entire day of scores, cheats or no cheats. If you miss a day at that level you may think to yourself that it isn’t worth jumping into a league. I think it is just as likely that nobody at that level and league waiting that long to join. I actually waited closer to 30 hours before joining.

I think it would be awesome to have an ABN league. Partly why I posted my findings here. You could post an ABN league start time using GMT+0 timezone so those wishing to be in the same league could all check their game results at the same time putting them in a high probability of being the the same league together.

[Immortal… Larry]

@steven-dunn-5648, I agree with that as well, although there are new players every day. In my arena friendlist, there’s more people joining each day as well. Imagine worldwide. Anyway, I think there’s only one way to find out for sure. I’d suggest setting up a birdsnest league where we try and make some (small) teams to sign in on different times on same and different days. That way we can see if it works out.

Let’s see if others show interest as well and then I’d be happy to organise a rally in here!

@mvnla2, you may want to join the arena after all, this may become exciting and we may need some low-level arena players for ehh, thorough testing…

[senigami]

@larry, My suggestion for ABN arena start times are 10:00pm (22:00) GMT+0, precisely 26 hours after day one start time. This seems like the widest coverage of English speaking countries I could come up with. My apologies to those in Asia but I am assuming that the majority of those on this site are from English speaking countries ranging from Australia to the United States, to Europe.

22:00 GMT+0 puts the times as follows:
Tuesday, 6:00 am in Perth, Australia
Monday, 2:00 pm in California, USA
Monday, 10:00 pm in London, UK

Upon joining the ABN league it would also be good, for the 1st day, to adjust your nickname to “ABN_[nickname]” so that we can affirm that we are all in it together.

[MVNLA2]

@larry @steven-dunn-5648 — Interesting! I am still in the wood league. Turns out I hadn’t signed in this week until just now, the message says 4 days left. Right now I am the only one on my learderboard! Woo-hoo! I might actually play some.
BTW, I have a bunch of FB friends for Epic, all of whom are members of ABN, a bunch of them are still in the wood league, and I would guess that they are not playing. So if you need more wood-league participants I could contact them.

[Immortal… Larry]

I would suggest a more secret schedule so we can actually test this method… what about making a schedule so we can organise participants in different timeslots spread over 2 days time. That way we can track the behavior of the arena. (sorry did not read @steven-dunn-5648’s post properly He’s already suggested the same)

We then send out the scheduled timeslots by private messages to prevent external influence. Anyone could join and we just create teams by level, rank and league…

[Immortal… Larry]

@mvnla2,@steven-dunn-5648,@burbman, It’s after midnight here and well past my bedtime, but I couldn’t stop myself because I think this is just too cool if we can make it work. I’ve opened up a new thread for this. Let’s continue this discussion in there. This way everyone will notice soon enough.

[MVNLA2]

Darn — Took awhile for for others to appear on my leaderboard (I played one battle), but now I’m 14 of 14. 1st place is at 23,280, 2nd and 3rd are at 17K, 7th at 7K is highest player below 10K. Interesting thing is that all of them have avatars, and only 1 is unnamed. Most are level 41, one 39 and 2 38s. It wood have been fun to advance out of the wood league with almost no points, but I’m not going to try for 17K.

[senigami]

@mvnla2, sorry to hear that. That news is most disheartening. It sounds like you managed to get cheaters in your league anyway. I just checked my level 41 league and I am still the only member in it. My level 5 league still only has 11 people. I suspect that once you are able to get out of the wood league you will have an easier time with the delayed start.

[MVNLA2]

@larry @burbman @all — Would be interesting if those of you who have been tracking how many points are reasonable in what period of time would figure out how long the other people on my leaderboard would have to have been playing if they aren’t cheating. Seems like an awful lot of points for 1 hr, but you guys know better. The time between when I joined a new league and when I noticed others had joined was less than 17 min (2 posts are separated by 17 min, but time on second post includes time to write it. I checked the league board after I posted the 1st post.)

[burbman]

@mvnla2 – any more than 6-7k in the first hour (including objectives being met) would be unreasonable. My thought is that you were assigned a league when you entered league to get your free roll on the GAPM. 17K looks like two days work for a hard core legit player, though since you are in wood league it could be three days objectives plus a few daily points earned in those battles.

[senigami]

@burbman, @mvnla2 – None of us know the actual rule set used for joining a league lineup. Best guess is you join based on [daily] 24 hour time slots which could join you to a game already populated with people who have been playing for hours for that day. This would be consistent with my level 5 game where I saw people joining throughout the day until some cutoff time where my league was locked in at 11 people.

[MVNLA2]

@burbman @larry @steven-dunn-5648 — How many arena battles do you play in a day? How many battles per hour? Since I’m not really playing the arena, my logic below may be faulty. Please let me know.
In the wood league (today), you can get 5500 pts for meeting the daily objectives, and you need to win 12 battles to meet the objectives, assuming a single battle only counts toward one objective. (For my objectives today, it might be possible to meet them all in 5 battles.) I supposed the entire leaderboard gets the same objectives each day???
I think the most you can get as an award for a single battle is less than 100K, so if you got the max reward for 10 battles, that would be 12K. Thus by meeting the daily objective, you would get 17500 pts. I am assuming that you don’t a new set of objectives just because you finished the first?
So to get more than 17.5K in a single day (or hour), you need to play additional battles that don’t count toward your objectives. For 17.9K (the 2nd place score on my board), you would need to play at least 4 or 5 additional battles. So players 2 and 3 would need to play ~15 battles to get their scores. Seems a bit much for 1 hr, maybe could be done in a day?
The first place player at 23.3K would need to have completed a second set of objectives or played at least 60 extra battles.
Actually, didn’t someone mention that the daily objective change at xam/pm in every time zone? So if all the people in the league I’m in joined within the previous 24 hrs, player 1 could have gotten 2 days objectives already. How does that work, anyway? His/her league would have to close at xam/pm local time, while the rest of us would still have several hours. Does that mean that each league can have several people in first place depending on what time zone they’re in?